A Pyrrhic Victory

1. The bank files a complaint with the court.Pays filing
fees,transportation expenses and meal allowances ni attorney.
(they cant do it pag over 10 years na ang account mo)
2. After maybe a month, the case is raffled-off to a certain
judge to handle ( hinde po automatic yan gaya ng sinasabi ni
Collector)
3. After maybe a month, the Judge issues a summons for you
to answer the complaint within 15 days upon receipt, in
order to hear your side.
(YOUR DISKARTE NOW. hayaan mo na lang ba or palaban ka?)
(the decision is always " You Pay" anyway )
4. After another month, you file a "Motion for extension to file answer"
kasi la ka pa abogado or si katulong nakalimutan ibigay sa yo ang summons.
('wag lang sumobra sa deadline ha?)
5. After another month (again!)the judge grants you another 15 days.
6. After another month again (!), your lawyer files for another
"Motion For Extension To File Answer" kasi ngayon lang niya nabasa
ang complaint.
7. After another month, the lawyer( FINALLY) answers the complaint,
asks the court to refer the issue for mediation.
(unless he files again another Motion for Extension for some reason)
8. After another month,sa pre-trial, you will appear (FINALLY)before
the Judge, even without a lawyer, for the initial stage of the
Mediation Process
(or you can even file ANOTHER "Motion For Postponement" - you are
undergoing surgery, prior important appointment like US Embassy interview?)
9. Mediation process ensues for three months?
"I can only pay P500.00 a month"
" I do not want to pay their excessive interests"

By now, this case has already drag for One(1) year!

After one year.... sad, but mediation fails.
The Judge handles the mediation.
another three months, perhaps? Still no deal.

10.Then, another Judge ay hahawakan na ang case(AT LAST).

After another three months....oops, nakalimutan ng court!
so the complainant will have to file a motion to set the case
for hearing? hmmmm.......

This is just the first phase.
maraming combinations pa ito.

Postponements after postponements. FINALLY (I hope this is the last)
the Judge hands down the decision.
" You Pay " ( but of course!)

Nope. This is not the end yet.
Complainant now has to file a " Motion To Execute Judgment" in order
that the Sheriff (whom complainant has to pay also)can look for your
assets. Otherwise, the decision will remain just like that
- a paper decision.

The Sheriff will then get your electric fan with your name prominently
etched on it?that's preposterous! He has to sell to convert it to cash
pa. What will the bank do with an electric fan? cheap naman nila.Bili
na lang tayo ng bago - made in China - mura pa.
Then, kung may sobra sa proceed ng auction sale, soli pa yung sukli mo!

The sheriff's Return(report)FINALLY (oh no, not that word again!)is filed:
" No assets can be found "

The bank wins the case. Gets nothing.
A Pyrrhic victory, indeed.

No Approved Therapeutic Claim

originally published May 31,2007

April 25,2008
Hi Rene:
I hope it's okay to call you by your first name :)

Anyway, I just want to share something to you. I am a bit shy about
posting this at our yahoogroup. I would not mind if you post it
though (without my name or email please)

A letter arrived from a collection agency (xxxxxxxx Credit and
Collection Services). This letter just proves that there is indeed
NO AMNESTY PROGRAM.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

Dear Sir/Madam:

Greetings!
One of our objectives is to help you ease the burden of carrying your
accountabilities. Thus, Credit Card Company is offering you a special
discount on your Credit Card with account number XXXXXXXXXXXXX,
which is now long overdue and demandable.

Your balance as of April 16,2008 is PhP54,127 but through this special
discount, you can now avail of the final settlement amount of
PhP36,217 as full payment of your outstanding obligation until
April 25, 2008.

If you wish to avail........ Blah blah blah

Very truly yours,

Mae xxxxxx

--------------------------------

This is what is FUNNY. I received my statement of account dated
April 20,2008 which indicated that my outstanding balance is at
PHP36,344.I do not know if the collection agency has been advised
that I am still receiving a monthly bill despite the fact that my
account has been suspended.

You are right! There is no AMNESTY PROGRAM! :)

The Harassment Process - The Visit

1. Don’t let them in; they might be holduppers for all you know.Ask for proper court orders
(See Rule 113 ( Arrests); Rule 126 (Search Warrants) of the Rules of Court)

2. Ask, politely and calmly, for supporting documents ( that is SOP)
a.any identification
b.authority to represent the collection agency
c.the authorized signatory of the collection agency
d.authority to represent the bank (Collection Agreement)
e.Bank’s Board Resolution appointing them as such
f.authorized signatory for the bank, duly notarized
g.Latest Statement of Account showing what you owe
b.SOA duly certified correct by the bank ( not them)

If they cannot produce ALL OF THE ABOVE, they are not authorized and are merely posing as representatives for the purpose of...tadah.... FRAUD. simply extortion.
CALL THE POLICE!!!!

3. If you’re in the office, tell the receptionist or the guards not to let them, if possible. you got so many reasons for that:
– "It’s against company’s policy to entertain personal visits during office hours",
"We’re having a meeting"
"The person you are looking don’t want to see you,"

If they insist, see no. 2 above.

4. If they are ever successful, don’t ever listen to anything they say nor sign anything. They got really nothing to say which you did not know already.Dont sign ANYTHING, even those "Amnesty Program" with offers "good until today only". Imagine signing your own death sentence?

Takot Kami

We often allow ourselves to be harassed, humiliated and fooled by these collectors. Worse,even our love ones ay SINISIGAWAN pa nila! Why? all because we are afraid that they will file a case against us and all those legal threats and ek-ek we innocently believe right away - kesyo may court case na nai-file na, si Sheriff Purontong will go to our house, Si Atty. Ilad (bisaya ni)can stop the case if you call him, you will be jailed and a lot of panloloko.

They Won't ; They Cant.
IF EVER, you will get a far BETTER DEAL in court than what they are demanding from you now.

YOU HAVE NO POWER OVER ME! Say that before every meal - YOU HAVE NO POWER OVER ME!

Sue Me!

to cut the long story short.
When you say those MAGIC WORDS, they will try to discourage you :
hanap ka na ng abogado mo ( I already did)
we will go to your house ( if you can show a court order)
we will go to your office ( just ensure you have a bank authorization)
we will get your things ( that's Robbery! kulong ka niyan.)
we will do this, we will do that ( still trying to fool me? no way, Jose)

Raket ( Caveat Part II)

sabi pa ng ex officemate ko na ex kolektor ang raket nila noon pag may natakot sila at nagbayad binibigyan nila ng ibang resibo they managed to create a resibo na mukhang official un ang binibigay nila sa nagbayad (kawawang defaulter!) tpos pagdating nila sa office at tinanong sila ni lawyer kung may nasingil sila ang sagot nila: WALA!!!

Sabi nga nya sken wag ako magbabayad sa kolektor kase malakas ang chances na di naman nila nireremit yun binayad mo. Worst case scenario, nangutang ka ng pambayad sa kolektor, si kolektor na corrupt kinupit bayad mo, si law firm gusto kumita ng pera binenta ung information mo sa ibang law firm.....may iba na naman kolektor na tatakot syo.

Chikit
Saturday, June 14, 2008
4:48:00 AM PHT
Feeling Knowledgeable

An Immoral Debt

Many times the Supreme Court has ruled that CC interest being charged is :

“excessive, iniquitous, unconscionable and exorbitant, hence, contrary to morals (”contra bonos mores”), if not against the law”

Since there is no longer a “Usury Law” to speak of, lenders and creditors are generally free to stipulate the interest rates to be imposed on debts. As a rule, the interest rate agreed by the creditor and the debtor is binding upon them. This rule, however, is not absolute but sadly, the court can only intervene if this issue is raised before them.

What about the Bible's view on this issue?

The bank responsible for these unconscionable lending practices takes refuge under religiously-mandated self-sacrifice to atone for the sin of borrowing unwisely. But lending money under this situation has in fact incurred the ire of the Prophets :

Ezekiel 18:13
“Hath given forth upon usury, and hath taken increase: shall he then live? he shall not live: he hath done all these abominations; he shall surely die; his blood shall be upon him.”

The debtor therefore who entered into such a one-sided arrangement in good faith need not feel that his inability to meet the agreement violates his duty as a Christian.

God has even given debtors a breathing space:

Deuteronomy 15:1-2
At the end of every seven-year period you shall have a relaxation of debts, which shall be observed as follows: Every creditor shall relax his claim on what he has loaned his neighbor; he must not press his neighbor, his kinsman, because a relaxation in honor of the LORD has been proclaimed“

He also frowns upon these oppressor-lenders:

Mt 18:21-35
‘You wicked servant! I forgave you all that debt because you besought me; and should not you have had mercy on your fellow servant, as I had mercy on you?’

And in anger his Lord delivered him to the jailers, till he should pay all his debt. So also my heavenly Father will do to every one of you, if you do not forgive your brother from your heart.”

Now, isn’t it comforting that even the Lord is on our side?

Feeling Marunong

Anonymous said...
i just discovered this blog... basically this whole blog is saying:
"kapalan nyo nalang mukha nyo at hindi nyo na kelangan bayaran utang nyo."

as in "Collector's face"?

"it's ok to borrow money to live beyond your means coz u don't have to
pay back the money anyway."

Its ok to collect money that is not yours and feed your
family with blood money

"Ok lang mangutang at hindi magbayad... wala naman magagawa yung
mga nagpautang sayo e."

Ok lang mag-collect at hinde i-remit. walang magawa
yung naloko natin

"Look at us, we owe tons of money to a lot of people and we aren't
gonna pay them back. Haha suckers!"

Look at us, dami naming na loko

"Only losers pay their debts."

Only Frauds collect fraudulently

Anti-Caveat

Here's a look at how "confidence" not "meekness" works for you

...hehehe i've really learned a lot from this blog banker and i owe this to you. I really feel so much better now, no more fears despite the fact that i am not yet debt free but somehow i've learned how to handle this kind of situation.

Another incident just a while ago, an account officer from SCB called up looking for me. As usual, i pretended to be somebody else and used different name. Ito yung naging conversation namin.

Collector (C): Ms. Worried please

( Normally pag may maghahanap sa akin whether official business calls or not, pag ako nakareceive ng call palagi ko sinasabi she's out of the resort or office)

Me: Sorry ma'am she's out of the resort right now.

C : Saan ba siya nagpunta?
Me: She went out to government agencies for some official business.
C : Alam mo Ms. X since blah blah blah.... hindi na namin siya nakakausap. sa'ng govt agency ba siya nagpunta? (galit na galit na siya)
Me : Nagpunta siya sa PHIC, BIR, HDMF, SSS... do i have to enumerate pa ba yung itinerary nya ma'am?

C : Ano ba talaga position nya jan?
Me : HR Personnel Ma'am ( I didnt say my exact position title)
C : Eh ikaw ano ba position mo jan.
me : Payroll Officer Ma'am
C : under ka ba nya o same level lang kayo?
Me : same job level
C : alam mo palagi kami tumatawag jan pero ikaw palagi sumasagot ng calls, ikaw lang ba tao jan sa office mo. Nire-relay mo ba mga tawag ko sa kanya at bakit palagi siya out of the office.Pwede ba makuha cellphone number nya
Me : Hindi mo naman siguro pwede questionin yung trabaho ng tao, that's part of her job at wala ka na pakialam don. i can not give you her cell no. and it would be impossible if you dont have her cellphone number. tawagan mo nalang siya if you really want to talk to her kasi she's not in the office nga right now.

C; Yun nga ang problema kasi she's not answering her phone. Maraming beses na kaming tumatawag sa kanya pero panay ring lang yung phone nya.
Me : Well that's not my problem anymore. Hindi ko rin pwede utusan yung tao na she must answer her phone kasi it's personal nga. Tsaka it's her phone not mine.

C: (hala grabe super galit na si manang). ok i think she's hiding. Tell her that this is from the legal office and blah blah blah ( but she failed to mention the name of the bank so i interrupted)

Me : From what bank is this? (pero panay parin satsat nya. non-stop na yung bunganga nya so i said "hey, this is not a business call for Ms Worried nor for me, I am asking you what bank is this kasi ang dami mo ng satsat and im busy. How would i relay to her na tumawag ka na hindi mo pa nga sinasabi kung what bank are you representing)

C : This is from SCB masmaganda siguro kung yung boss nalang ni Ms Worried yung kakausapin ko. Sino ba ang may ari ng company nyo?

Me : The owner is in japan Ma'am baka gusto mo tawagan sa Japan office namin kasi don cya naka base hindi dito

C : Ok can i have the name and tel number
Me : Well im sorry Ma'am but im not in authority to disclose the owner's name and the office number.

C : ( grabe na talaga galit nya ) Ako ba Ms X niloloko mo? You want me to call the owner or Japan office but you are not giving me the number.

Me : Well ma'am binibigay ko lang sa'yo yung gusto mo mangyari. You said "I want to talk to the owner or Ms Worried's boss" then im telling you where's the owner. So what's the problem then? Am I not giving you a favor?

Hayun sa sobra galit nya binagsakan ako ng phone. hehehehe
Ang sarap din kung minsan mag entertain ng pikonin na collectors.


Posted by Ms.Worried
Tuesday, June 10, 2008 3:34:00 PM PHT

Caveat !

When we are afraid, in love, too trusting or overwhelmed by problems, our brain shuts down our logical reasoning.So, take heed of those emotions.

2 wks ago I received a call from a J&T forwarding services, ang sabi may package daw ako from USA, sabi ko wala akong kilalang Tony Gao na magpapadala sa akin.Idedeliver lang daw the ff. wk yung package. Kinuha pa nila yung cell no.ko.

Then after a week nakareceived ako ng text msg na "1st last summon letter@XXX, plaintiff vs civil case no. XXXor?(preliminary attachment proptery) w/in 24 hrs @judge Manolo Francisco of RTC 32 subpoena will be served by sheriff escobar/spo2 ortis for violation of RA8484 FRAUDULENT ACT OF 199/CRIMINAL CASE ART 315 D RVSD PENAL CODE YOU ARE BEING SUMMONED TO APPEAR IN COURT FOR PRELIMINARY HEARING PLS CALL 02-xxx TO COORDINATE AND LOOK FOR RENE TIANGCO.

Na-shock ako kasi di ko alam na may case pala ako. Nagreply ako sabi ko wala akong alam tungkol sa case na ito. Sabi nung nagtext from RTC daw sya at tawagan ko daw si Rene Tiango ASAP. Di ko tinawagan yung binigay nyang no. nung May 19 ko nareceive yung txt.

Then ngayon May 29, may nareceive na call yung office mate ko from Police station daw SPO3 Gonzales at may complainant daw sa akin dun sa station at kailangan kong pumunta or tawagan ko sa cell yung babae. Ang ginawa nung office mate ko tinawagan nya yung binigay na no. at kinausap kung anong problm kasi wala pa nga ako sa office lunch brake kasi. Ang sabi daw nung babae kasi may case daw ako na fraudulent act akong ginawa at pati daw sa company namin. di naman sinabi anong klase yun.Sabi lang tawagan ko yung boss nya or sya para malaman ko. So, Syempre kinabahan ako bakit may police ng tumatwag.

Tinawagan ko yung no. at hinanap ko yung boss. Nung nakausap ko sabi ko wala akong narereceive na demand letter or subpoena man lang about the case. Sabi nya di daw ako nagbayad ng bankard ko mga 200,000 thousand pesos ngayon umaabot na sa 600,000. pesos. Nagulat talaga ako sabi ko matagal na yung bankard credit card ko siguro ten years ago na yun at ang natatandaan ko lang mga 10k lang yung di ko na settle at na di ako siningil.kaya akala ko wala na. yung di ko nabayaran pero di naman aabot sa ganung halaga. tsaka di naman ako lumipat ng bahay at nagresign from work nung mga panahon na yun.

Tapos tinanong nya kung may check ako at bayaran ko lang daw yung amt. Ano? sabi ko simpleng employee lang ako at wala akong ganung halaga. Basta sabi nya puntahan ko daw yung secretary nya dun sa police station para malaman ko yung complaint.Kung di ako pupunta ipapahold nya ako sa police at pupuntahan ako sa office.

ang ginawa ko pinatawagan ko sa Atty. namin yung nakausap kong lalaki na di naman pala atty. at ang sinabi lang naexplain na daw sa akin kung ano yun. Nung nakausap ko yung atty. namin puede akong di pumunta dunm pero para daw malaman ko talaga kung anong klaseng kaso yun punthan ko pero magpasama ako sa kapatid ko.

Kaya pumunta ako sa police station at nagtanong kung meron bang nagfile ng complaint sa akin, wala naman daw, sabi baka sa ibang police station kaya tumawag pa sa radio yung police kung meron sa ibang station pero negative naman.

My Worse Nightmare

Gas prices going up daily that you want to kill yourself? It's nothing compared to the daily harassments CC victims experience. Here's the real worst nightmare:

HI everyone. I've been reading posts here and want to share my 2 cents.. I've been through a tedious court case involving a loan with usurious interest. It's now in CA on appeal by the other party claiming i need to pay principal + interest + compounded interests. My claim is to pay only the principal since we don't have any written agreement. Nanalo na ko sa RTC, so inelevate nila sa CA. Being involved in a case like this opened my eyes to our civil rights and legal rememdies available to people na nababaon sa utang. Believe me, DON'T GET INTIMIDATED BY THE PROSPECT OF BEING SUMMONED TO COURT. Judges favor mediation between parties. Pag umabot na sa court, mas malaki nga ang mase-save niyo lalo na if you tell the judge you can only afford a certain amount to pay. Ex: may judge na sa isang BP22 case may utang na 78T, e 10T lang ang pinabayad ng judge dun sa pinagka-utangan nung tao na may case filed na bouncing check. Maniwala kayo, di kayo pakukulong ng judge sa utang.

Yes, my case is against a couple. The amount we're talking is in the millions. Actually nag claim na ako na bayad na ang utang ko, sa laki ng interest na naibayad ko na sa couple na ito. Sabi nga ng RTC may utang pa sila sa akin na P2M. Kumbaga, I already overpaid due to the unconscionable interest charged me, e wala naman kasing written agreement. However in the case of credit card, may agreement tayong pinipirmahan right? Kaya lang super unconscionable din ang interest nila. Ang point ko lang, most of the concerns here are apprehensions about being haled to court for credit card debt. Gusto ko lang iparating sa lahat na HUWAG MATAKOT SA COURT ORDER kung totoong umabot na sa demandahan (however in the case of most cc companies e pananakot lang ang ginagawa). Based on my experience (meron na din akong several experiences on failure to pay cc dahil nga dito sa malaking pagkakautang ko sa couple na ito, di ko na nabayaran cc bills ko), I would rather face a judge in court than face creditors na tatakutin ka sa garnishment, etc. Alam nyo bang mag-file ka lang ng case e malaki na gastos mo? You have to pay filing fees, lawyers fees, not to mention the hassle of attending hearings.. cc companies avoid going thru all this expense and hassle, kaya inaasahan nalang nila ang collection agencies or insurance.

alam ng mga cc companies na pagdating sa court ng collection case, e sa mediation lang ang bagsak, meaning, magkakatawaran din sa harap ng judge. this is what usually takes place before the judge during a mediation between creditor and debtor:
judge: how much is the amount we're talking about?
debtor: Php xx amount, say P100t
judge: both parties are willing to settle?
both: yes
judge: debtor, how much can you afford to pay?
debtor dictates the amount. kahit sabihin mo P5t lang kaya mo ibayad the judge will accept that.
judge: creditor, can you accept that amount?
usually pag sinabi ng creditor unacceptable, the judge will encourage tawaran between parties to arrive at a settlement beneficial to both parties. the judge knows how much cc companies suck on the blood of debtors kaya mas pinapaboran nya ang pobreng debtor.
ayan, narinig ko na ito while sitting in several courtrooms during the course of my case. sana mapanatag na kayo.
siempre this is not always the case but ito lang yung sinasabi kong reality.

From the post of Sanay Na